Curse

Wyler_Clan · Sep 28, 2007, 07:47 PM // 19:47

Hi All --

I have seen Monks in PvE carrying shields, which gives me pause to ask the following:

1) Why would a monk would carry a shield?

2) What to do with it if I do carry one?

3) When looking for one what attributes should I be looking for (assuming one is a good thing)?

Thanks in advance,
Wyler.

Stormlord Alex · Sep 28, 2007, 08:01 PM // 20:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wyler_Clan

1) Why would a monk would carry a shield?

Extra defense/health. Max energy is pretty useless to lug around the whole time, if you run low switch to a focus.

Quote:

2) What to do with it if I do carry one?

... learn to passively manage energy... and carry a focus.

Quote:

3) When looking for one what attributes should I be looking for (assuming one is a good thing)?

Really low tactics if you could afford one... tbh, the mods are more important (+30hp, +10 AL vs Fire, Slashing etc.)
And be sure to carry a focus.

Quote:

Thanks in advance,
Wyler.

No problem.
Focus!

moriz · Sep 28, 2007, 08:08 PM // 20:08

monks carrying shields to gain extra defense. that's about it. the practice got it's start in gvg, where a monk would use a shield for added defense as well as hiding a portion of their energy from e-denial. over time, people realized that monks do not actually need a huge energy buffer, since most of their spells are cheap and can be maintained by efficient use, so their "default" set becomes their shield set. and like just about everything that happens in gvg, the trend of wearing a shield eventually filtered down to the pve public.

MisterB · Sep 28, 2007, 08:09 PM // 20:09

1. Because you only need a focus for extra energy, and you only need extra energy for a couple seconds while casting a spell. You might also want the percent chance for faster cast/recharge, but switching to focus before cast will activate those bonuses, too. Carrying a shield increases your armor and health, and "hides" your energy from e-denial.

2. See # 1. Basically, carry the shield most of the time, and swap to focus to cast. More armor is better than more energy if you don't need to use the energy, and you can switch if you need the energy.

3. +30 Health and Physical -5(20%), probably. I don't monk, so I don't know what mods are desirable beyond the health. The requirement doesn't matter, you won't be putting points into the attribute in almost all cases. Just make sure it's a 16 armor shield, and no attribute points means you can carry an extra 8 armor.

Celestial_Kitsune · Sep 28, 2007, 08:52 PM // 20:52

Guide to Monk Shields

Ensign · Sep 28, 2007, 09:25 PM // 21:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wyler_Clan

1) Why would a monk would carry a shield?

The same reason every other class in the game should carry a shield - the extra defense. If you are not attacking or casting a spell, the weapon and offhand that you have equipped do not matter, so they might as well be as defensive as possible, with as much health and armor as you can get. A lot of the time it doesn't cost you anything and has a lot of benefits. If you're taking fire and running away, for instance, pulling out a shield and health weapon can help you survive longer at no cost. If you are just standing there waiting, as Monks often do, you might as well be in a shield set; that leaves you as well defended as possible for whatever might go wrong.

The benefits you gain from using caster items aren't all that important a lot of the time. The +12 energy, for instance, is only a useful mod to have when you need more *current* energy; as long as you have enough energy to cast the spells you would want to cast, that +12 is doing nothing for you. You would be better off with a shield exposed to reduce some damage, and then pull out your focus when you need the energy.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wyler_Clan

2) What to do with it if I do carry one?

Put it in a weapon set with a +30 HP weapon, and get in the habit of using that set whenever you don't need to be using any other set, including but not limited to when moving; when standing somewhere not casting; when using skills that do not benefit significantly from cast time / recharge / enchanting modifiers; when your energy is high.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wyler_Clan

3) When looking for one what attributes should I be looking for (assuming one is a good thing)?

+30 HP and +10 AL vs <type>. Serious players often have extensive shield collections and use whichever shield protects against the biggest threat in an encounter. If you are only going to carry a single shield, I would suggest +10 AL vs Slashing or +10 vs Blunt. Those are the most common and dangerous damage types you'll face, and either one of those modifiers will outperform a -2 while enchanted or -5(20%) shield by a wide margin.

Age · Sep 28, 2007, 10:41 PM // 22:41

Geoffor's Bulwark and there is another good one.It is what I use.

Div · Sep 28, 2007, 11:44 PM // 23:44

For 3, it depends on what kind of PvP you'll be doing and when. For stuff like HA where there is a lot of gimmick fire eles, having a +10 vs fire would be helpful. Stuff like +10 vs lightning used to be great with the amount of ritspikes going around. To be fully prepared, you really need all the different types of +10 armor +30 health shields.

Bellth · Sep 29, 2007, 12:19 AM // 00:19

Generally, Monks carry around a shield as defense, swap to it when needed. But some Monks just like to look fancy, I really wouldn't suggest it if you can't weapon swap, and if you do, make sure to have an offhand handy just in-case.

General stats on a Monks shield are,
+30hp
Reduced Physical Damage -5 (20%)
Req doesn't usually matter, but 9 is good.

Boops · Sep 29, 2007, 04:39 AM // 04:39

remember that bad players actually cast while holding a shield, so swap to a protection/healing/whatever set when casting spells from those attributes

«Ripskin · Sep 29, 2007, 04:54 AM // 04:54

I use a dmg -5 20% hp+30 shield.

And I started using shields in TA before PvE

Ensign · Sep 29, 2007, 06:21 AM // 06:21

On some skills it doesn't matter if you swap to cast them at all, ala RoF. Others it can make a huge difference (Aegis).

There's nothing wrong with casting on your shield set, especially if you're under fire. Only a few spells benefit so much from caster item mods that it's worth taking extra damage to cast them off of a shield.

The -5 (20%) mod is one of the worst shield mods in the game; only the bad condition ones (reduce disease duration etc) are worse. -5 (20%) mods are for inflating the price of a shield before you sell it to someone bad at Guild Wars, not for use.

Div · Sep 29, 2007, 06:47 AM // 06:47

Don't listen to the people saying that -5 20% is good. You're much better off getting a +10 vs slashing against normal warriors, +10 blunt vs thumpers/hammers, and +10 vs fire in HA (or against rodgorts pressure). The +10 armor along with the +8 base armor for shields usually equate to ~25% reduction against that type of damage.

Ensign · Sep 29, 2007, 08:51 AM // 08:51

Some crude numbers to help explain why -5/20% mods are so bad:

+10 armor vs a type of damage is approximately 16% damage reduction against that type of damage. That's a bit better than taking off 1/7th of the damage.

-5/20% takes off, on average, 1 damage per hit.

Against a particular damage type, +10 armor vs that type and -5/20% are equivalent when you would otherwise be taking 7 damage per hit. More than that, and the +10 vs type is a better mod.

-5/20% works against all 3 physical damage types, while +10AL only works against one type. If you are expecting an even mix of all 3 physical damage types, and feared them all equally, then it would make sense to take the +5/20% mod when the average hit you take deals 21 damage. If you take more than 21 damage per hit on average, then +10 armor against any one of those physical damage types is going to do more than +5/20%.

An average level 20 monster does damage very similar to a player. Sword and axe hits deal about 35 damage, bows 40, hammers 50. Higher level monsters deal more damage as appropriate.

On a caster that never changes which shield he uses, you're going to prevent twice as much damage with the +10 AL mod over the -5/20% mod, and that's assuming you're fighting normal level 20 enemies. Against higher level monsters, or in hard mode, or against bosses, the +10 AL mod looks even better by comparison.

Plus you can tailor your shield to a particular set of enemies; if the piercing or blunt damage is more dangerous than the slashing, you can switch shields and get even more of a benefit. But again even if you never switch in PvE, you're preventing a whole lot more damage with the +10 AL shield than the -5/20% shield - instead of it triggering randomly, it only triggers against certain damage types.

The only place you should ever consider DR shields is on a Warrior or other hard target with a lot of inherent armor and armor buffs; when you have a ton of armor, DR becomes more attractive to clean up the damage that comes through. On a caster, DR is virtually never better than +10 vs slashing, piercing, or blunt.

deluxe · Sep 30, 2007, 01:46 AM // 01:46

btw, dont merchant blue r7 tactic 15 al shields, i've gotten loads of em since NF and GWEN. use them on my monk. (got 3 of them sweet r7 darkwing defenders already :P)

Snow Bunny · Sep 30, 2007, 02:00 AM // 02:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by deluxe

btw, dont merchant blue r7 tactic 15 al shields, i've gotten loads of em since NF and GWEN. use them on my monk. (got 3 of them sweet r7 darkwing defenders already :P)

Yes. Omg. Instead of those prices RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GOing r7 16ALs, get these. All my shields are these now

Bellth · Sep 30, 2007, 03:37 PM // 15:37

Don't forget were taking about PvE. Not all people can afford a different shield for each damage source.

Div · Sep 30, 2007, 10:06 PM // 22:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bellth

Don't forget were taking about PvE. Not all people can afford a different shield for each damage source.

Then just get a +10 vs slashing and overall you'll be doing much better than if you took a -5 20%. Plus, I can generally buy three +10 vs XX shields for the price of a -5 20% shield since the +10 shields are generally a lot less desired by pvers and are much cheaper.

Cherng Butter · Oct 01, 2007, 04:56 AM // 04:56

Let's not forget that Shields often look very cool compared to focus items!

Side note, I found a r7 15 AL inscriptable shield today :P

lazuli · Oct 04, 2007, 09:31 AM // 09:31

you know, while we're on the topic of monk shields, usually my wand is +5e/20% and the focus is +30hp/20%, which means only one fortitude mod, but when i switch to my kiting set (wintergreen shield/spear) i have the choice to fit in 2 fortitude mods at the expense of imbalancing my hp when i swap foci.

so the question is: at the moment, i only have one fort mod in my kiting set, but do all you wise men out there usually carry 2 fort mods on your kite set or only one?
(i used to use the +5AL while casting presear crystalline with another +5AL mod on it, right now i use a 20% ench/+5e spear-basically a caster weapon- and the usual +30hp/10AL vs slash/pierce/blunt wintergreen shields)